A new trend looks to be on the rise, once again, where women with children have started to try to shame or make fun (and not in a light spirit) of women who are 30+ and have no children, have not settled, have not married. I do not like this trend, as I don’t see this shaming anything but petty – as in the real world, pointing out their situation – it will not help any women 30+ to actually get to all that. I will also leave it out here – maybe, indeed, I have a bit of a bias, as I, too, am 30+, and yet, no children (and Lord knows I do want them);
But why I keep coming back to thinking about this, the silly clash between antinatalists, imaginary antinatalists, and the red-pilled ladies, isn’t personal – as in I am not getting attacked (at least for now) – the way it is done now, the antinatalists might as well counter the winger-waving by doubling down, ah, see, these women regret having given up their independence. They wouldn’t be so bitter at us, otherwise!
I had my first serious crush when I was 14 – the guy was just so dreamy! But life was pretty messed up back then, and I was a confused girl, looked 4 years younger than I was, and often would escape to my Neverland where I’d actually made up a world, people, friends, enemies, and of course, even a partner inspired by that very same crush.
But I didn’t go to Neverland because I wanted to avoid growing up. I went there because I had fuck all to do – other kids my age wouldn’t invite me to their late night parties where they drink and smoke and fuck around (and I heard there even were fights!). I have no idea what life was like for other teenagers. Mine was in a school of war magic, and going after an evil spawn of it with the love of my life.
I thought about it just the other day – coming back to what being introverted means. It used to go along the lines, “I am more interested in what’s going on inside my head than in other people.”
That’s wrong, and it’s always been wrong. That statement above has just been something I say to myself to soothe my lack of options. I have always wished to connect with people – on such a level that I understand them, they understand me, and there is mutual interest – I have always wished there was someone I could build something together with. But somehow these kinds of connections never happened – most connections there ever were, were very shallow – and when we start to think why there were not any connections – I was just not a very useful networking node – I fell to the edges of the network, and eventually fell out from all of them.
If you wonder how this has anything to do with settling down and having children – then I’ll say – if you don’t understand this on your own, I won’t bother breaking that part down much more than following: human networks are a part of finding a partner – for most people, anyway.
The slightly longer part of my teenage wasn’t spent in Neverland, but I actually did manage to find some kind of a network – or two. But neither of those converged into something long-lasting, either. The first guy I ever held hands with and hiked the town – well, there was something off-putting about him, and he disappeared anyway. The first guy I actually had for a boyfriend checked himself into a new network just after 4 months and found a better girlfriend from there. Good riddance, though – he only had complaints, anyway!
And he wasn’t the last boyfriend who was like that. Looking back – I was willing to take a lot of shit just to keep a guy. Complaints, demands, and the conditions that I eat the pills to prevent pregnancy. And this is the point where many so-called red-pilled people like to wave their finger, that I have been stupid for selling myself short, and it’s all my fault.
I don’t deny my responsibility, either. Neither the fact that I was stupid. I also happen to know that there was absolutely no scenario where this would have gone any differently, unless…
Unless the people I met on the way were different, unless there was a guy who had their shit together better than I did. By saying this I am not trying to discount my part in my failures – but my point – a lot of our life, and those big decisions – is purely up to chance. You either meet the right person, or you don’t.
And if you are not very sure what the right person should be like, you don’t even know if he would exist. You might humbly accept any dude that gave you some good attention, and assume this must be it, and will work out somehow. Even when the guy demands you must eat the pill and never ever bring up the topic of marriage again (and maybe even say that you’d make a terrible mother), you hope, patiently wait, maybe one day he’ll wisen up and present the ring and willyoumarryme.
I have tried that! And innit just another Neverland 🙂
What I find the red-pillers seem to miss out is that finding the partner you can and want to have kids and all that isn’t something that can be achieved by trying it systematically. As much as antinatalists are overly-rational with their reasons-to-not-have-kids, I find the red-pillers, looking from the sidelines and forgetting about all their own shit (unless they were lucky enough to not experience any) – their reasoning about just leave the wrong guy and don’t give up – are equally over-rational.
Life is messy, if you’re in the wrong relationship for 3 years, and then in another wrong relationship for another 3 – maybe even with people you aren’t particularly attracted to, but for some reason it seems to work “good enough” (apart from the complaining and lack of syngery) – your first thought after breaking up with the latter might not be, “okay, I’m going to find a guy on MY terms, this time.”
By this time, let’s say, our Neverland Miss has broken up with the second “long term” guy, and maybe she’s something like 26. Still young, still time to find a guy to get children before 30!
Rationally, yes. In real life, not always so. A person who has been going in the wrong direction, and once again, has dropped out from any or all social networks (and I mean the people kind, not the ones you find in the internet) – will not have much motivation or incentives to find any connections again. Make no mistake – that’s all she wishes – a meaningful connection with mutual interests and understanding – but at that point – it seems impossible. She might even think that there must be something wrong with her, she’s mentally ill, not fit to be a partner, neither a mother.
So, we’re back to Neverland, for a while. If a person is left alone after such a caroussel ride – there might even not be any coming back. It is especially dire if you do not have a family to turn to, to stay in touch with – if even they do not try to connect with you – or for various reasons you don’t want to (life is messy, there could be grudges – and for good reasons).
It could also be at such a point, for whom it was at 26, or for whom it was at 30 – because surely, some girls stick around in relationships that do not work for longer than I did – and once they come out, they have a lot of cleaning up to do. So, in that sense – I see nothing wrong with the image with a wheeled suitcase and a glass of champagne. Or a headset and a mustard-stained shirt, fronting a computer, playing Neverland games with other Neverland people.
But it will only remain a phase if something starts shining through. A phase that might very well be necessary after a long series of poor choices that couldn’t be helped – so, instead of judging them, maybe reach out to them and offer company when they come back from their trip. If they say they never want kids of a husband – consider it’s not something they are really convinced in – it’s something I’ve said when I felt utterly defeated.
I was so utterly defeated I was even looking to become a nun, youknow!
The transition from there to here, however, happened in small increments, at start. I tell you – every time a person actually does invite you out to talk about whatever, even if it will be a one-off only – it changes things. It won’t of course go from a few years of neverland and not wanting to have anything to do with the opposite sex and what they could build together to totally wanting it all right after one tea-date with an old friend – but it’s a start.
If you can ever be that friend to anyone – you have no idea, how powerful that is, even if you don’t see the feedback right away. Maybe you see it in 2 years, or less, or more – but it changes things.
My first date after a long period of not seeing absolutely anyone (aside from two very terrible one-offs during the Neverland time), was incredibly horrible. Talking about this makes my heart sick, I didn’t trust my gut – which told me to turn that ask down, and got date raped. The guy didn’t disappear right away, though – and for whatever the fuck reason, neither did I – back to the old version of me where I was going to endure whatever shit just to keep up a relationship…
If that guy hadn’t called the whole thing off a month later – and he did so with a great number of complaints on my account – that I wasn’t taking care of him enough and all that (I was still recovering myself! wtf man) – I wouldn’t have had the guts to break it off, either. I just didn’t have it in me.
And when I had some time to think about what had been going on, and despite how horrible it all had been from the first day – I tried to set up more dates with different people… And after consulting strangers on the internet, I heard one of the wisest things – something that is very helpful to someone in my position.
“Stop worrying about whether he likes you. Make sure you like him.”
And as silly as it may sound, the other piece of advice came from broken-hearted listening to some JBP, where he had spoken of some good values, morals, that kind of thing, and his question was, “well, what kind of a man do you want?”
Strangely enough, as soon as I had thought about it, made some kind of a list of red and yellow flags – made rules for myself to cancel a guy as soon as something was fishy, made sure I can at least try to view people impartially, and for the sake of long-term, I shouldn’t HOPE to see the ideal guy in anyone that I come across… The universe no longer challenged me and somehow sent me a guy without any of those flags.
Two years later, we married. Now I’m waiting for scientists to teach me how to have sex so I can have those damn kids too.
Anyway, this personal account now exists to illustrate why it doesn’t help anyone, mocking single chicks, but may be just spewing more hatred and contempt.
If you have a single friend who may have found the church of antinatalism or just insists on staying single or wanting no children, one thing that you could actually help them with is with similar lines of thought I got from internet strangers or that line from JBP…
It will be very difficult to pin down what kind of a man someone wants – because no matter how many positive traits there are – it could all be set off by one red flag… So, the most important perspective would be from the Via Negativa – when dating, never go in without knowing what you definitely don’t want. Just keep it to that one date and then delete.
And never – Ever – Go to a private place for a first date.